https://fourthievesvinegar.org/
It is not a solution, but maybe an alternative to death…
Why can’t Americans mail order it from Canada? Is the US going to tax the crap out of it when it crosses the border?
Yes they will absolutely fuck you on it IF they even allow it at all.
You know, in the spirit of “free markets” and all that bull shit.
What website would we mail order it from?
Fuck.
US Healthcare = pay or die
Oh, it’s not that good.
It’s “Pay until you run out of money and can no longer take on more debt. Then die.”
If you talk about killing the few people like these that are the root cause of all these problems, you’re a terrorist. You go to jail
These people actually kill people by the thousands, millions, and we call them smart CEO’s and celebrate them 🥂
Free Luigi.
There is plenty of propaganda on social media to exalt the billionaires and CEOs. Instagram is especially really bad at it. I don’t know why the algorithm suggest heavily to me about “entrepreneur” pages (maybe my investing platform sold my data), although some of these pages whitewash literal fraudulent and underhanded behaviours from celebrity CEOs and fraudsters, spinning their past behaviours as “another way to get rich”. I also think the posts and profiles were written by bots, because the language and syntax used sound almost identical from one another, in spite of these profiles supposedly being independent from one another.
I’m not diabetic and the situation with insulin fills me with a white hot rage.
Same
Naive question from a european: Aren’t there companies on the market who can offer a cheaper price and therefore beat greedy competitors?
the problem is that there is natural (as in, unmodified) cheap generic insulin available, it’s just that it sucks compared to everything else. you see, insulin is a peptide that is supposed to appear, do some signalling, then disappear and unmodified insulin copies this thing exactly. the problem is, most of the time when peptide is supposed to work as a pharmaceutical, you don’t want to do that, you’d like insulin to last longer than usual, which means changes to it that make breakdown slower, or adding something that makes it stick to albumin, which has similar effect because it hides insulin somewhere enzymes can’t reach it and also it makes it start acting slower. this means less frequent dosing and less changes in insulin activity over time. there are also other insulins that start acting faster than natural, and this is also due to a couple of modifications in its structure
for another example, ozempic was not the first drug in its class, it’s also a modified peptide, and it can be injected s.c. once a week, compared to previous iteration (liraglutide) that requires daily injections. if natural peptide is injected i.m. instead, its halflife is half an hour, and in serum it’s only two minutes (it gets released a bit slower than it is metabolized)
manufacturing costs are about the same for any variant, most of it is in purification. patents for a couple of these have expired anyway by now, but if manufacturing is limited then price can be set arbitrarily high (see daraprim)
Costs aren’t just research and purification, it’s also good manufacturing practice and quality control.
Oh wow, an actual nuanced response and genuine answer!
Also today I learned!
Correct, but when it’s already been established that people will pay those prices, they keep them high. So instead of going from $800 to $5 out of the goodness of their hearts, they go from $800 to $650 (number made up) to get more business but still make massive profits.
You’d THINK capitalism would cause that to happen, wouldn’t you?
A lot of the benefits people associate with capitalism require a free market. The US problem is that the megacorps have gotten sufficiently powerful to abolish that free market through regularory (and legal) capture, enabling entrenched monopolies.
Doesn’t work when people don’t get to choose not to take it when it gets too expensive! That thing that capitalists always forget about: necessities.
Every time someone talks about you being supposedly free to choose where to work they should get instant diarrhea. Let alone medicine of course, that’s a hard dependence.
Nobody is truly free without proper UBI and free healthcare and good public transport. Only then true freedom can exist.
Amen!
What USA is experiencing is feral Capitalism.
Crony capitalism
Yup, but their products don’t work as well, don’t work for everyone, or have other downsides. Banting’s original insulin would be dirt cheap today, but it’s shit compared to what we have now, so the best products on the market today charge a premium for either efficacy or convenience.
California is contracting its own insulin supply and it’ll be available for $11 a pen starting Jan 1, 2026. I know not every state can or are willing to do this but just throwing out some examples and hopefully optimism to somehow fight the American decline from within it. We’re in a unique position as our state economy is larger than most countries but I am hopeful we will throw our weight around to counter the bs. https://www.chhs.ca.gov/blog/2025/10/17/governor-newsom-announces-affordable-calrx-insulin-11-a-pen-will-soon-be-available-for-purchase/
I know not every state can or are willing to do this
this kind of thing scales well, i see no reason why after california has it set up, other states couldn’t get insulin from them, or chip in
I would think Big Pharma will aggressively fight against it.
Seems like something other states should get in on. Now that the program is established seems like it would not be as hard to pay into it and get a share of the product.
But that’s socialism! /s
Meanwhile, 10 euros per vial here in Europe. At least his original plan for widespread and easy availability has partially succeeded.
In brazil 36 reais (about 6 euro). The US is a joke. (And im 99% sure you can also get it for free if you use the public health network)
I have mental health disabilities in the USA and my meds are at zero cost because I literally have had absolute zero income for the past 5 years.
You wouldn’t believe how much those mood stabilizer/antidepressant cocktails stack up proportionally when I was able to scrape by on $15 an hour.
The system set me up to fail with how shitty it is, if healthcare wasn’t crap I could be contributing to society without crippling myself.
In civilized countries at least.
Canadians: invented drug and patent it freely
Americans: Finds way to kill the most people possible while making the most amount of money
To be fair, the killing isn’t the point; they’re the product. Its just that profit is God, so killing in its name is justified.
Killing poors for the joy of it? That’s just an evil bonus.
Killing me soupy with his words.
Soo why sell the patent for $1 and have it be potentially exploited when you could hold onto it and licence use for free?
IIRC the insulin being sold now is manufactured differently and the patents are completely different anyway
But overall your point is good
It is different, but it’s still incredibly cheap to make, $4 a vial, so it costing in the hundreds is just antihuman…
It’s not anti human, the rest of us get it just fine. It’s specifically anti-american
This is a great way of phrasing things.
Services that are necessary for life (like healthcare)…if other countries have figured out how to make it affordable/free (at point of use), any person or industry that tries to extract profit out of it is literally anti-American.
Bingo. It’s extortion and if the asshat in charge gave any kind of a real fuck about cheap medicine it should’ve been a day 1 fix.
The insulin produced now has benefited from advances in technology just like most things. The fast acting insulin is predictable and works in 45 minutes to an hour and a half. The original insulin took hours and wasn’t nearly as predictable or stable. Testing/monitoring technology has seen even more significant advances.
I owe Banting and his colleagues my life, but it is different. That’s not to say that the continued well being of the public should be profitable and exclusive.
I mean insulin is about 10x more expensive in the USA compared to other Western countries. It’s cheaper still in lower income countries. Many European countries also have a price ceiling for medication, so your monthly cost for life-saving drugs is capped.
I don’t know exactly why a manufacturer doesn’t set up production for much cheaper generics in the USA, but for whatever reason Americans are getting price gouged like Satan doesn’t believe in tomorrow.
Whatever reason? Simple reason: legal to maximize profits over people’s misfortunes.
To be fair, most Americans agree with the capitalist first approach right up until it affects them individually. If they were willing to help each other instead of believing that anyone other than themself is a freeloader and lazy, they would have the support that other countries take for granted.
They wouldn’t be ‘freedom loving’ or ‘American’ if they actually gave a shit about other people.
It was sold to a Canadian public university to manage the patent for public good.
They have, everywhere else in the world basically, insulin costs pennies.
In America, they have been able to patent certain formulations and delivery methods, and they keep making marginal modifications to string the patents out to keep Americans locked in to absurd insulin prices.
Was that the answer you thought it was going to be?
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I wondered if all the sane Americans did a mass exodus to Canada, Europe, UK, Australia etc, what effect that would have
A lot of us would need financial sponsorship. So there’d be a literal financial drain on those economies.
I still would like to sign up.
Not if you stayed, then it’s an investment. Money doesn’t just disappear when goes to poor people, they use it to buy things like food and stuff. It would only be a financial drain if you were sending that money back home.
The North American mind cannot comprehend the benefits of supporting the poor.
UBI should be ubiquitous.
UBI = Universal Basic Income
Amazing Americans say with their full chest this is socialism
Perhaps strain would be a better word than drain - it would still be a short-mid term financial burden to take even a tiny fraction of the sane population from the US, it’s a big country. Sure would be nice if it could be arranged though…
True.
And a hell of a good one. Adults will have already passed through education, so we would save on that part.
I get that, the initial investment would be pretty significant.
I’m not against it of course, I just think it’s necessary to understand the risks of any gamble.
It’s already happening, there’s been a deluge of affluent people leaving the US.
We’re still at the stage where it takes considerable privilege to just leave everything behind and pay the exit extortion (40% of all your shit).
Once things get worse and people have nothing to leave behind you’ll start seeing the engineers/doctors escaping.
Have you looked into what it takes to get a permanent visa to one of those countries? It’s not easy.
Its prohibitively impossible.
Its not that hard especially for an American.
It is that hard, I’ve looked. You typically need to rank highly on a skill list AND have a relatively well-paying job offer. And if you think it’s hard interviewing in your own country, it’s far worse interviewing outside of it.
What are you comparing it to? Americans have a much easier path to permanent residency than a vast majority of the world.
Take a look at the skills lists they aren’t that insane. Also you dont need to go straight for permanent residency you can start with a working visa which is easy to get.
In comparison yes, it’s easy. In practice it’s far outside the means of the average American. Hell, more than a quarter of all households in the US are living paycheck to paycheck right now. That’s effectively impossible.
I did it a while ago, would recommend.
If you don’t mind sharing, did you have to pay the exit tax? Actually, what was your way out?
Exit tax is only if you give up your US citizenship, which you definitely can’t do if you don’t have another citizenship and even then it’s very often not required
No exit tax. Academia/skilled worker route, I’ve been beelining an out since I was a teenager and I qualify for EU citizenship on heritage, working on that. I would like to thank my now irl friends from thousands of hours on EU MMORPG servers for unintentionally guiding me out. 👾❤️👾 Love my girlies.
Aren’t you still paying taxes to the USA? Just curious.
You have to earn over something like 100k+ for the US to tax you. Salaries are lower here.
Ohhhh that’s interesting.
You still have to file, but you don’t need to pay taxes unless you’re earning enough that the visa won’t be a problem.
But, like, if you close everything out and never go back…
The IRS will still find you lol
But then what?
Is a foreign government going to extradite you for missing paperwork and no outstanding tax debts (especially because everyone else thinks it’s nuts that we require nonresident citizens to file taxes)? I guess it’s possible, but it strikes me as very unlikely.
But if you’re still financially attached to the US/likely to visit, they’ve got some power over you.
I’m not a lawyer or an accountant (obviously. This is not best practices)
Why would that strike you as unlikely? It’s extremely likely because most countries that people would want to flee to already have extradition agreements with the US.
All the US has to do is declare you a fugitive and those countries will pick you up and ship you back.
Especially with how petty this administration has been.
What do they get out of it? It’s expensive and you don’t even actually owe money. Plus, extradition agreements only cover either things that both countries consider illegal, or a set of very serious crimes, like murder, afaik.
It’s usually too expensive to justify pursuing international cases, nevertheless don’t fuck with the IRS lol. That being said, people moving abroad to escape debt, such as student loans is not altogether uncommon.
Americans suffer from Stockholm syndrome
I would literally move if I could afford it and if it was even a little easier.
Stockholm syndrome suggests we enjoy it or want to be here.
Reminder that the term Stockholm Syndrome was coined to blame victims for being rightly more afraid of the police than their captors:
In [Jess Hill’s] 2019 treatise on domestic violence See What You Made Me Do, Australian journalist Jess Hill described the syndrome as a “dubious pathology with no diagnostic criteria”, and stated that it is “riddled with misogyny and founded on a lie”; she also noted that a 2008 literature review revealed “most diagnoses [of Stockholm syndrome] are made by the media, not by psychologists or psychiatrists.” In particular, Hill’s analysis revealed that Stockholm authorities, responded to the robbery in a way that put the hostages at greater risk from the police than from their captors (hostage Kristin Enmark, who during the siege was granted a telephone call with Swedish Prime Minister Olof Palme, reported that Palme told her that the government would not negotiate with criminals); as well, she observed that Bejerot’s diagnosis of Enmark was made without ever having spoken to her.
Otherwise, we probably agree that AmeriKKKans are a feckless, servile people.
Nils Bejerot was a total hack. He tried to ban comic books, and later transcribed that same energy in a war on drugs that has resulted in some of the worst health outcomes for drug users in Europe. Unfortunately his ability to be confidently incorrect swayed a lot of gullible rubes, and his legacy still casts a shadow over Sweden to this day.
Stockholm syndrome is a proposed condition to explain why hostages occasionally develop a psychological bond with their captors. It is named after an attempted bank robbery in 1973, in Stockholm, Sweden
?
My comment was in response to a comment about AmeriKKKans having “Stockholm Syndrome”, which as it turns out is not a real or valuable diagnosis. However, I do not disagree with the implied critique of AmeriKKKan people as being feckless and servile people.
You lost me with thebrepeated “amerikkkan” thing.
A: It completely undercuts the seriousness of your comment and makes the whole thing come off as a tirade by an edgy teenager.
B: Jokes don’t get funnier every time you repeat them, it was mid the first time and eye roll worthy by the 3rd.
I agree with your points, just sucks that you chose to present it in such a juvenile way.
A: It completely undercuts the seriousness of your comment and makes the whole thing come off as a tirade by an edgy teenager.
So you disagree with the tone and not what I’m saying? Because if so, that sounds like a “you” problem, i.e. you’re more interested in the tone of a message than its content.
B: Jokes don’t get funnier every time you repeat them, it was mid the first time and eye roll worthy by the 3rd.
It’s not a joke and it’s not supposed to be funny. I genuinely hate the USA and everything it stands for.
Man you really need to work on your communication if you ever want anyone to listen to you.
This is very much so a you problem because you’re not going to get far acting like this to people who agree with you.
No I’m pretty sure you’re a liberal, right? We probably do not agree almost at all. See this video for more information.
Boo-hoo buddy who the fuck cares, clearly you do and you felt the need to tell everybody on the net like a fucking baby
Wow such maturity, this is why nobody takes tankies seriously.
Don’t worry when you grow up and learn how to communicate effectively people will listen to you.
The fuck did you just call me weirdo quit trying to fucking put me in a box, fuck off
AmeriKKKans
whoa! so edgy, poignant, and relevant!
and so creative!
amazing!
*and everyone clapped*AmeriKKKa is a settler-colonialist project, and the entity and its defenders deserve zero respect. I mentioned AmeriKKKans because the person I replied to used Stockholm Syndrome to critique AmeriKKKans on a post critiquing the AmeriKKKan healthcare system, so critiquing AmeriKKKa is relevant here. And I don’t like spelling AmeriKKKa as part of USA correctly because (1) places like Central America and South America should be distinguished from the United States of AmeriKKKa, and (2) it offends the people who need to be offended, i.e. people who still feel affinity for the AmeriKKKan project and people who tone-police others who are just brutally honest in speaking their minds.
You are literally posting from an anarchist Lemmy instance, why TF is this controversial to you?
wow, each time you write “AmeriKKKa” you just get so so much smarter.
it makes me really care about what else you have to say… so so much!That guy is a fucking idiot apparently. I hope they get the mental help they obviously need
Yeah I hope I get the mental help I obviously need…oh no wait I’m in the US so no I won’t
Yeah I stand by my statement, you can regurgitate things I agree with but you’re absolutely insufferable.
When the people who agree with you think you’re an asshole, you’re fucking up badly.
Go learn some social skills and try again.
Fine, just do Ctrl+F, replace each instance of AmeriKKKa with {insert preferred term for the United States}, and move on with your life. Like I’m not even trying to get you to say it, I’m just saying it. It’s almost like you have a problem with what I’m saying and not just how I’m saying it…
It’s funny how you can russlr your Jimmy’s just by saying a simple word, you wouldn’t have to be Conservative weirdo are you
Shoutout to the uninsured cost of the medication I need to live
(90 tablets)
Does anyone really need to live? What you need is to be producing value for your company!
/S
Also I just remembered, I used to have United Healthcare and they didn’t cover this medicine so I had to switch. Had to pay ~$300 for that refill (i think it was fewer tablets and 75mg that time). $40 on my current insurance.
Anyway I’m a big Luigi fan
wahoo
If I’m remembering the original sysntesis for insulin used dogs, and it was harvest from them after being killed. It’s unjust that insulin is so expensive, but also modern production methods are not the problem here. It’s greed.
I summon, Luigi!
My name’s not Luigi
What are you summoning
grunts Damn thing isn’t working.
