As much as I’d wish otherwise, there’s still genuinely no par to Microsoft Excel, the one software almost all businesses and orgs in the world run on. That status has remained despite Microsoft trying their best to enshittify it through forced Onedrive and now Copilot.
For personal use, Libre office does everything I need. For work, Excel is an absolute beast. It doesn’t necessarily scale, but for those one off data comparison, manipulation, or validation often I can do it faster and easier than I can in SQL. VLookup was kinda cool. Index match is definitely powerful.
I still generally avoid the vb macros though I’ve found solutions online occasionally where they’re useful. (Reviewing the code to confirm it’s not malicious first of course.).
Fair, I still use Office 2007 via Wine. Even the newest one has the killer features (unless it’s the awful web version) but your willingness to use it depends on how strong your aversion towards proprietary OSs and AI is
The changed the name of some stupid as shit “app” that only exists to open links to the Office programs on the web as webapps, which was apparently called “Microsoft Office App”. They did not change the name of Microsoft Office.
Simultaneously not as bad, but even dumber.
Edit: Since there’s nothing that goes together quite like Linux enthusiasts and pedanticness, here’s a correction-
Microsoft split off a subscription based version of their Office suite of programs a number of years ago, calling it Microsoft Office 365. They maintained more standard non-subscription versions for a few years alongside 365, while very clearly trying to push people to the subscription model.
After that, they stopped releasing new standard versions, leaving Microsoft Office 365 (the subscription) as the only option for ongoing support.
After that after that, they renamed Microsoft Office 365 to just Microsoft 365, although the Office branding/tagline/wording is still present in a number of places (just not on office.com itself, apparently).
One of the 365 license options allows for access to only the webapp versions of the suite instead of the native program versions. Apparently they offered a “Microsoft Office App” specifically for users on this license that would simply link to the webapp versions of the suite.
This “Microsoft Office App” that served as a link to the webapps is what has been renamed to Copilot whatever the fuck, not the suite of webapps and native programs themselves. That remains named Microsoft (Office) 365.
You’re right: strange how they keep shoving things nobody wants in the name of their product - first “Office” became “Microsoft 365” (subscription-only), then “with Copilot” (opt-out upsell) and now the mandatory Copilot upsell.
The silver lining is, small and medium-sized companies are increasingly ditching the pricey offering for employees who don’t have document editing a major part of their duties, making them realize LibreOffice is now good enough for their personal needs.
I sure hope that’s true, but I’ve seen more companies switch to lower cost licenses with restrictions like only being able to use the webapp than I have seen switch to LibreOffice.
As long as Microsoft keeps offering ways to easily disable the shit nobody asked for in corporare environments/deployments I’m afraid the stranglehold will persist.
“Office” is completely removed from https://www.office.com/
The only place “Office” can still be found is in the urls. It’s called “Microsoft 365” now.
Edit: My mistake, “Office Home 2024” is still a thing you can buy apparently, but it’s not the full package and isn’t being updated. I’m pretty sure Libreoffice is a full replacement for “Office Home”
The change to “Microsoft 365” has been the case for years now. I had hoped the context made it clear that this was regarding the claim they had changed the name to Copilot.
Edit: Since there’s nothing that goes together quite like Linux enthusiasts and pedanticness, here’s a correction-
Microsoft split off a subscription based version of their Office suite of programs a number of years ago, calling it Microsoft Office 365. They maintained more standard non-subscription versions for a few years alongside 365, while very clearly trying to push people to the subscription model.
After that, they stopped releasing new standard versions, leaving Microsoft Office 365 (the subscription) as the only option for ongoing support.
After that after that, they renamed Microsoft Office 365 to just Microsoft 365, although the Office branding/tagline/wording is still present in a number of places (just not on office.com itself, apparently).
One of the 365 license options allows for access to only the webapp versions of the suite instead of the native program versions. Apparently they offered a “Microsoft Office App” specifically for users on this license that would simply link to the webapp versions of the suite.
This “Microsoft Office App” that served as a link to the webapps is what has been renamed to Copilot whatever the fuck, not the suite of webapps and native programs themselves. That remains named Microsoft (Office) 365.
Legit had somebody angry with me at work because their copilot button wasn’t showing in Outlook… Like what? If you can’t even write your own emails why are you even employed? “What would you say… You do here?”
Oh, you’re right. Without “App” though, that slipped through because someone wrote “the Microsoft 365 Copilot app” (a string you’ll see in official MS texts) in title case.
For the desktop app that only opens links to the webapp versions of Office
They did not fucking rename Microsoft Office. It’s dumb enough without everyone uncritically parroting the misleading clickbait.
Why in the fuck was there even a desktop app to just open the webapp links? That’s dumb as shit! Why the fuck would anyone care about it enough to rename it? That’s even dumber! Why would…
You get the picture.
The reality isn’t as bad, while simultaneously being even more dumb.
Edit: Since there’s nothing that goes together quite like Linux enthusiasts and pedanticness, here’s a correction-
Microsoft split off a subscription based version of their Office suite of programs a number of years ago, calling it Microsoft Office 365. They maintained more standard non-subscription versions for a few years alongside 365, while very clearly trying to push people to the subscription model.
After that, they stopped releasing new standard versions, leaving Microsoft Office 365 (the subscription) as the only option for ongoing support.
After that after that, they renamed Microsoft Office 365 to just Microsoft 365, although the Office branding/tagline/wording is still present in a number of places (just not on office.com itself, apparently).
One of the 365 license options allows for access to only the webapp versions of the suite instead of the native program versions. Apparently they offered a “Microsoft Office App” specifically for users on this license that would simply link to the webapp versions of the suite.
This “Microsoft Office App” that served as a link to the webapps is what has been renamed to Copilot whatever the fuck, not the suite of webapps and native programs themselves. That remains named Microsoft (Office) 365.
I would have hoped the context made it clear that I’m talking about the claim they renamed it to Copilot.
Nothing “half right” about it, but thanks for the pedanticness I guess.
Edit: Since there’s nothing that goes together quite like Linux enthusiasts and pedanticness, here’s a correction-
Microsoft split off a subscription based version of their Office suite of programs a number of years ago, calling it Microsoft Office 365. They maintained more standard non-subscription versions for a few years alongside 365, while very clearly trying to push people to the subscription model.
After that, they stopped releasing new standard versions, leaving Microsoft Office 365 (the subscription) as the only option for ongoing support.
After that after that, they renamed Microsoft Office 365 to just Microsoft 365, although the Office branding/tagline/wording is still present in a number of places (just not on office.com itself, apparently).
One of the 365 license options allows for access to only the webapp versions of the suite instead of the native program versions. Apparently they offered a “Microsoft Office App” specifically for users on this license that would simply link to the webapp versions of the suite.
This “Microsoft Office App” that served as a link to the webapps is what has been renamed to Copilot whatever the fuck, not the suite of webapps and native programs themselves. That remains named Microsoft (Office) 365.
collaboration with classmates that use office, mostly
i guess we could use collabora or onlyoffice? but i feel like if i go to them asking “hey can you all create accounts on other services which you will find worse so i can avoid using a laggy website” they’ll just call me a nuisance
i guess we could use google docs, frankly docs is better than word online imo, but even then it’s trading trash for garbage…
I haven’t used spreadsheet software in decades, but I have helped some convert to Windows to Linux. Some of them did use Excel, and therefore had to learn to use LibreOffice Calc, and while they had some expected difficulties during the initial learning curve, they did say a few months later to me that they were eventually satisfied with the software.
Nevertheless, I’m sure much like the GIMP/Photoshop comparison, Excel simply has features that Calc doesn’t.
I am mildly curious. Could you give an example of a feature that its likely many businesses and/or individuals use in Excel that simply doesn’t exist in, or is too difficult to implement in Calc?
I use excel for my daily work. I have no idea what Power Query is. I have never used a pivot table. I use xlookup maybe once a year. My co-workers immediately zone out when I try to explain that function to them. Most of them use + - * / sum and maybe an average from time to time. They think I’m a hacker because I wrote a custom function for a calculation I frequently need.
From my experience with people in offices I’m pretty sure I’m on the tech savvier side of the user base and the vast majority of users will never actually see the difference in functionality between excel and calc.
My bet is that there’s some weirdly complex things that become too niche edge cases that are difficult to transfer.
My opinion is when your logic becomes too complicated, maybe you want to have some sort of custom software. But, on the other hand, I understand that if it works already, there’s no need to break it either.
There are several types of basic Excel formulaes that don’t work on web Excel, and are ofc not in Calc either. Same with VBA integrations (within Excel and other Office/Windows services) that are used as core data transformation infrastructure to run entire companies, lmao.
Not necessarily. It’s often less Calc’s capability that is at issue, and moreso its compatibility with imported sheets. Calc tends to have every feature I need when I make a spreadsheet.
As if any amount of customisation is going to make LibreOffice not look like a janky mess on anything except the exact desktop environment and DPI settings one developer had…
Not that appearance is the most important thing in the app but whenever I open up Calc and half the UI is in dark mode, the other in light mode, half the UI is scaled to one DPI half to another, all the icons look like the best an unpaid software developer could do with 5 minutes in The GIMP circa 1995, it makes me cry a little bit.
The web version is very inferior to the desktop one. I had to use it at work and it was a very frustrating experience, e.g. missing many conditional formatting options.
Great news, now MS Office is all that’s left.
That doesn’t exist. It’s Copilot 365 now so you’re not missing much.
As much as I’d wish otherwise, there’s still genuinely no par to Microsoft Excel, the one software almost all businesses and orgs in the world run on. That status has remained despite Microsoft trying their best to enshittify it through forced Onedrive and now Copilot.
For personal use, Libre office does everything I need. For work, Excel is an absolute beast. It doesn’t necessarily scale, but for those one off data comparison, manipulation, or validation often I can do it faster and easier than I can in SQL. VLookup was kinda cool. Index match is definitely powerful.
I still generally avoid the vb macros though I’ve found solutions online occasionally where they’re useful. (Reviewing the code to confirm it’s not malicious first of course.).
I mostly just import the data into PostgreSQL and write queries. Not because excel can’t do it, but because I hate it.
I only need simple excel and mostly rely on word processing so I’ve never actually known what exactly ms excel has that libre doesn’t
Is it like actual macro/coding capabilities within excel or just convenience/file compatibility stuff?
I think the main issue I’ve seen is when people need bug-for-bug (or nearly so) compatibility with VB macros.
For me it’s the macros. Simple ones will work in LibreOffice Calc but the more complex ones crash.
Fair, I still use Office 2007 via Wine. Even the newest one has the killer features (unless it’s the awful web version) but your willingness to use it depends on how strong your aversion towards proprietary OSs and AI is
That was horrendously misleading clickbait.
The changed the name of some stupid as shit “app” that only exists to open links to the Office programs on the web as webapps, which was apparently called “Microsoft Office App”. They did not change the name of Microsoft Office.
Simultaneously not as bad, but even dumber.
Edit: Since there’s nothing that goes together quite like Linux enthusiasts and pedanticness, here’s a correction-
Microsoft split off a subscription based version of their Office suite of programs a number of years ago, calling it Microsoft Office 365. They maintained more standard non-subscription versions for a few years alongside 365, while very clearly trying to push people to the subscription model.
After that, they stopped releasing new standard versions, leaving Microsoft Office 365 (the subscription) as the only option for ongoing support.
After that after that, they renamed Microsoft Office 365 to just Microsoft 365, although the Office branding/tagline/wording is still present in a number of places (just not on office.com itself, apparently).
One of the 365 license options allows for access to only the webapp versions of the suite instead of the native program versions. Apparently they offered a “Microsoft Office App” specifically for users on this license that would simply link to the webapp versions of the suite.
This “Microsoft Office App” that served as a link to the webapps is what has been renamed to Copilot whatever the fuck, not the suite of webapps and native programs themselves. That remains named Microsoft (Office) 365.
Microsoft’s original and horribly misleading blog post that started this shit here.
The Verge’s article laying things out more clearly and featuring direct statements from an M$ exec to The Verge trying to clarify things here.
You’re right: strange how they keep shoving things nobody wants in the name of their product - first “Office” became “Microsoft 365” (subscription-only), then “with Copilot” (opt-out upsell) and now the mandatory Copilot upsell.
The silver lining is, small and medium-sized companies are increasingly ditching the pricey offering for employees who don’t have document editing a major part of their duties, making them realize LibreOffice is now good enough for their personal needs.
I sure hope that’s true, but I’ve seen more companies switch to lower cost licenses with restrictions like only being able to use the webapp than I have seen switch to LibreOffice.
As long as Microsoft keeps offering ways to easily disable the shit nobody asked for in corporare environments/deployments I’m afraid the stranglehold will persist.
“Office” is completely removed from https://www.office.com/ The only place “Office” can still be found is in the urls. It’s called “Microsoft 365” now.
Edit: My mistake, “Office Home 2024” is still a thing you can buy apparently, but it’s not the full package and isn’t being updated. I’m pretty sure Libreoffice is a full replacement for “Office Home”
The change to “Microsoft 365” has been the case for years now. I had hoped the context made it clear that this was regarding the claim they had changed the name to Copilot.
Edit: Since there’s nothing that goes together quite like Linux enthusiasts and pedanticness, here’s a correction-
Microsoft split off a subscription based version of their Office suite of programs a number of years ago, calling it Microsoft Office 365. They maintained more standard non-subscription versions for a few years alongside 365, while very clearly trying to push people to the subscription model.
After that, they stopped releasing new standard versions, leaving Microsoft Office 365 (the subscription) as the only option for ongoing support.
After that after that, they renamed Microsoft Office 365 to just Microsoft 365, although the Office branding/tagline/wording is still present in a number of places (just not on office.com itself, apparently).
One of the 365 license options allows for access to only the webapp versions of the suite instead of the native program versions. Apparently they offered a “Microsoft Office App” specifically for users on this license that would simply link to the webapp versions of the suite.
This “Microsoft Office App” that served as a link to the webapps is what has been renamed to Copilot whatever the fuck, not the suite of webapps and native programs themselves. That remains named Microsoft (Office) 365.
Microsoft’s original and horribly misleading blog post that started this shit here.
The Verge’s article laying things out more clearly and featuring direct statements from an M$ exec to The Verge trying to clarify things here.
Microsoft 365 Copilot App
That’s the official name
Legit had somebody angry with me at work because their copilot button wasn’t showing in Outlook… Like what? If you can’t even write your own emails why are you even employed? “What would you say… You do here?”
Oh, you’re right. Without “App” though, that slipped through because someone wrote “the Microsoft 365 Copilot app” (a string you’ll see in official MS texts) in title case.
That makes it semi-official. If Microslop put that on their official website for the product, that makes it official to a degree.
It’s not a part of the title but yes, “app” is the official descriptor now.
For the desktop app that only opens links to the webapp versions of Office
They did not fucking rename Microsoft Office. It’s dumb enough without everyone uncritically parroting the misleading clickbait.
Why in the fuck was there even a desktop app to just open the webapp links? That’s dumb as shit! Why the fuck would anyone care about it enough to rename it? That’s even dumber! Why would…
You get the picture.
The reality isn’t as bad, while simultaneously being even more dumb.
Edit: Since there’s nothing that goes together quite like Linux enthusiasts and pedanticness, here’s a correction-
Microsoft split off a subscription based version of their Office suite of programs a number of years ago, calling it Microsoft Office 365. They maintained more standard non-subscription versions for a few years alongside 365, while very clearly trying to push people to the subscription model.
After that, they stopped releasing new standard versions, leaving Microsoft Office 365 (the subscription) as the only option for ongoing support.
After that after that, they renamed Microsoft Office 365 to just Microsoft 365, although the Office branding/tagline/wording is still present in a number of places (just not on office.com itself, apparently).
One of the 365 license options allows for access to only the webapp versions of the suite instead of the native program versions. Apparently they offered a “Microsoft Office App” specifically for users on this license that would simply link to the webapp versions of the suite.
This “Microsoft Office App” that served as a link to the webapps is what has been renamed to Copilot whatever the fuck, not the suite of webapps and native programs themselves. That remains named Microsoft (Office) 365.
Microsoft’s original and horribly misleading blog post that started this shit here.
The Verge’s article laying things out more clearly and featuring direct statements from an M$ exec to The Verge trying to clarify things here.
Well, you’re half right, except Microsoft did rename Office years ago to “Microsoft 365”.
Edit: ignore the “Microslop” spelling. I have a uBlock filter enabled.
I would have hoped the context made it clear that I’m talking about the claim they renamed it to Copilot.
Nothing “half right” about it, but thanks for the pedanticness I guess.
Edit: Since there’s nothing that goes together quite like Linux enthusiasts and pedanticness, here’s a correction-
Microsoft split off a subscription based version of their Office suite of programs a number of years ago, calling it Microsoft Office 365. They maintained more standard non-subscription versions for a few years alongside 365, while very clearly trying to push people to the subscription model.
After that, they stopped releasing new standard versions, leaving Microsoft Office 365 (the subscription) as the only option for ongoing support.
After that after that, they renamed Microsoft Office 365 to just Microsoft 365, although the Office branding/tagline/wording is still present in a number of places (just not on office.com itself, apparently).
One of the 365 license options allows for access to only the webapp versions of the suite instead of the native program versions. Apparently they offered a “Microsoft Office App” specifically for users on this license that would simply link to the webapp versions of the suite.
This “Microsoft Office App” that served as a link to the webapps is what has been renamed to Copilot whatever the fuck, not the suite of webapps and native programs themselves. That remains named Microsoft (Office) 365.
Microsoft’s original and horribly misleading blog post that started this shit here.
The Verge’s article laying things out more clearly and featuring direct statements from an M$ exec to The Verge trying to clarify things here.
It works with Crossover, just hope they can port their changes one day.
oh god please. i need ms office for uni, i use the browser version, and holy shit is it bad. it makes me regret google docs…
just curious, what do you need it for alternatives like wps and lo can’t do?
it’s excel isn’t it?
collaboration with classmates that use office, mostly
i guess we could use collabora or onlyoffice? but i feel like if i go to them asking “hey can you all create accounts on other services which you will find worse so i can avoid using a laggy website” they’ll just call me a nuisance
i guess we could use google docs, frankly docs is better than word online imo, but even then it’s trading trash for garbage…
it’s garbage that runs in a browser though!
Fortunately it takes only around 5 minutes of customizing the appearance of libreoffice to have it exactly how you want it
lol no, Calc comes nowhere near the functionality of Excel no matter how close you make its UI.
I would imagine the vast majority of Excel written everywhere uses very basic features.
I haven’t used spreadsheet software in decades, but I have helped some convert to Windows to Linux. Some of them did use Excel, and therefore had to learn to use LibreOffice Calc, and while they had some expected difficulties during the initial learning curve, they did say a few months later to me that they were eventually satisfied with the software.
Nevertheless, I’m sure much like the GIMP/Photoshop comparison, Excel simply has features that Calc doesn’t.
I am mildly curious. Could you give an example of a feature that its likely many businesses and/or individuals use in Excel that simply doesn’t exist in, or is too difficult to implement in Calc?
Power Query is the biggest one. It used to be pivottables and formulae like xlookup as well, but Calc seems to have caught up to them nowadays.
I use excel for my daily work. I have no idea what Power Query is. I have never used a pivot table. I use xlookup maybe once a year. My co-workers immediately zone out when I try to explain that function to them. Most of them use + - * / sum and maybe an average from time to time. They think I’m a hacker because I wrote a custom function for a calculation I frequently need.
From my experience with people in offices I’m pretty sure I’m on the tech savvier side of the user base and the vast majority of users will never actually see the difference in functionality between excel and calc.
My bet is that there’s some weirdly complex things that become too niche edge cases that are difficult to transfer.
My opinion is when your logic becomes too complicated, maybe you want to have some sort of custom software. But, on the other hand, I understand that if it works already, there’s no need to break it either.
There are several types of basic Excel formulaes that don’t work on web Excel, and are ofc not in Calc either. Same with VBA integrations (within Excel and other Office/Windows services) that are used as core data transformation infrastructure to run entire companies, lmao.
I was not aware of these. Thank you for making me aware of them.
Not necessarily. It’s often less Calc’s capability that is at issue, and moreso its compatibility with imported sheets. Calc tends to have every feature I need when I make a spreadsheet.
As if any amount of customisation is going to make LibreOffice not look like a janky mess on anything except the exact desktop environment and DPI settings one developer had…
Not that appearance is the most important thing in the app but whenever I open up Calc and half the UI is in dark mode, the other in light mode, half the UI is scaled to one DPI half to another, all the icons look like the best an unpaid software developer could do with 5 minutes in The GIMP circa 1995, it makes me cry a little bit.
Already runs in browser
The web version is very inferior to the desktop one. I had to use it at work and it was a very frustrating experience, e.g. missing many conditional formatting options.