- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.world
When called out on it, they then doubled down on this dogshit take: https://archive.ph/quYyb
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People forget that the current antitrust actions against Big Tech were started under the first Trump admin.
So shut the fuck up Andy, you’re out of your element.
Trump doesn’t go after big tech to help the little guy. Trump goes after big tech to bring them to heel.
The dumbass CEO has fallen for the MAGA lie that these billionaires are working for the the “little people”. They work for no one but themselves and their loyalists.
Is it true though? Not sure it’s the case: Lina Khan was nominated by Biden.
Is it true though?
Yes. AG William Barr sought to force backdoors in encryption in 2019. You can read all about it in the article I linked to.
I think they were asking about the actions against big tech starting under Trump. My memory ain’t what it used to be (& it was never very good), but even if something was started under Trump there have been various actions taken against big tech going at least as far back as the Internet Explorer near-monopoly days - so it’s not exactly like they did anything new, special, or unprecedented.
EDIT: Can some kind soul take pity on me and explain why I’m getting downvoted, instead of just a hit & run? What did I get wrong?
explain why I’m getting downvoted,
Oh, don’t bother! Sometimes it feels like even asking for people to explain their downvotes invites more downvotes for some inexplicable reason.
Oh, don’t bother! Sometimes it feels like even asking for people to explain their downvotes invites more downvotes for some inexplicable reason.
Without referring to the specific post in question, I have some comments about that.
Different people downvote for all sorts of different reasons. Some downvote if they disagree with a statement, some downvote because they don’t like the way the statement is presented (eg. I often downvote posts with huge embedded memes, even if I like what the meme says); some downvote because they don’t think the context is appropriate (even if they agree with the ideas said, they might be seen as the wrong time / place); some downvote due to a misunderstanding or perhaps an ambiguity in the post. etc. etc. And very often, posts with more than one idea in them are downvoted by people who agree with part of it but disagree with another part (even if the second part is minor and insignificant).
So then, if someone says something like “I’m being downvoted because xyz”, they’ll almost certainly be downvoted by a heap of people who had a different reason in mind. If a person says “show me where I’m wrong”, that apparently ignores the other possible reasons for downvotes - and can sometimes imply arrogance and stubbornness - which of course will invite downvotes. And if someone just asks “why am I being downvoted?” it might be interpreted to mean “I don’t deserve to be downvoted” - which of course will also invite more downvotes.
Thanks for laying it out. Yeah, I’ve thought about this and I do get it that we’re all different. I wrote that out of exasperation from the inconsistency and just plain old pettiness that seems to underline some of those motives that leave people confused.
My criteria is: does this contribute to the conversation in any meaningful way and is it grounded? So to me things like downvoting because of some arbitrary reason that only serves the voter feels selfish and shallow and pointless. It’s almost destructive, even, when previous voting scores hold some momentum and impact how the thread is perceived. For example, some folks have been downvoted to hell because someone misinterpreted their comment and replied with a popular opinion totally missing the point, framing the first person a moron but without critically looking into what they’re saying beyond first the impression. (Man, I wish I could find that one exemplary thread easily.)
I know, I know, the points are made up and don’t matter, but sometimes they mean something to those who receive them.
But anyway, thank you for your synthesis, you sound like a very smart cookie.
donvotes dont mean you’re wrong. they mean you made someone mad. sometimes this is because you said something they know is incorrect. but more often its because what you said may be true, and disagrees with their worldview or ideology.
Yes it’s true. The Trump administration initiated the first major antitrust lawsuit against Google in 2020.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/10/20/justice-department-antitrust-case-google-430281
But it doesn’t make up for the myriad of other shitty things he’s done. Keeping Lina Kahn on would have been the absolute easiest way to assuage public concern, if he actually gave a fuck.
Or like, telling Musk and Zuck to get fucked.
Mostly I remember him getting angry at all the fact checking bots (election, Russia, etc) that Twitter, Facebook, and Google introduced and that was one of the ways to go after them.
I don’t really care what the reason is, personally.
Well sure, but if he’s going after then because they are big corporations, fine. But it’s another thing if he’s going after certain big corporations because they are an inconvenience/opposed to him. He’s going to stop going after the big tech companies once in they are in line with him… Like stopping fact checking and what not.
What does ths forced backdoor have to do with the text you quoted?
Because Andy was saying something that people forget and OP is pointing out something Andy is forgetting? It is pointing out Andy’s bias or ignorance to make Trump look good
Official statement from Proton, after I filed a complaint:
Hello, Thank you for contacting us. We appreciate you reaching out, please be informed that we have shared a response to the community feedback which can be found here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ProtonMail/comments/1i2nz9v/on_politics_and_proton_a_message_from_andy/ We hope you find this information helpful. Should you have any further issues, questions or perhaps a concern that you’d like us to address, please do not hesitate to let us know.
Kind regards,
Ethan Customer Support Proton Mail
My response:
Hi,
Thank you for your response. I wish this would clarify everything, however, the comments he made on Reddit were done with the official Proton admin account, therefore making his personal comments an official Proton statement. https://snoo.habedieeh.re/r/ProtonMail/comments/1i1zjgn/comment/m7ahrlm/ Next to the fact that he posted his personal believes as an official Proton statement, the claims he made are factual untrue, making Proton spread fake news (as noted in the comments under Yen his statement). If it indeed it is just his personal opinion, he should have posted everything from his personal account only.
I have my personal opinion which I don’t mind sharing with others, but I won’t use a company account to make these claims as that could get me fired.
Andy Yen didn’t make Proton a part of his opinion by just sharing it, but by sharing it as Proton. I believe Proton should take action if Proton doesn’t want to be affiliated with Yen his personal opinions and with the fake news he spreads.
I would like to know what Proton will do about this incident and how Proton will ensure this doesn’t happen again in the future as incidents like these make Proton look unprofessional and breaks trust with its customer base, one which holds privacy and security high. When the CEO is so easy to manipulate by populists and fake news from another country and makes this official Proton statements, how can the company ensure what it stands for.
Kind regards,
W
Getting real fuckin tired of having to always find ‘alternatives’. Can’t yall rich bastards just stop being weird and be content with making good products. Just cause you have money, doesn’t mean you need to have a public opinion on anything, ever
This is what I feel is the core problem of out-of-bounds capitalism today. 50-80 years ago there were fabulously wealthy people as well, but they were taxed out the wazoo and were still fabulously wealthy. And even though every corporation’s goal is, and always has been, to make profit, it feels as if it’s gone from “profit” to “maximum possible profit at ALL costs, including the damnation of life on the planet”.
We have plenty of examples of hypercapitalism destroying us in fiction (cyberpunk etc.) but our current reality is really really close to that hellscape. In some ways it’s actually worse because of the insidiousness and banality of the evil that lords over us daily.
Sorry im not from the US… what is a “wazoo”?
It’s written as “up the wazoo” or “out the wazoo.” “Wazoo” in this context means “ass” and the meaning as a whole is “in large amounts.”
Feel free to steal that one. It’s fun to say. It’s an older slang though
wazoo = anus
It’s just a figure of speech to denote “completely”, or “very much”.
Where a kazoo goes.
Man have I been using mine wrong
Anyone who becomes rich will work to protect that wealth.
Gotta support FOSS alternatives.
Buy your own domain and use a service like mailbox.org which is in Germany.
Also super easy to move to a new email host later when you have your own domain.
Does posteo support “catchall” addresses?
Sounds like you might enjoy Apple products.
Welllll Tim Cook did personally donate $1M to Trump’s inauguration fund…
This is def not what going full MAGA looks like, lmao. This tame AF.
Delusional ideas tied to cult of personality directly at odds with objective reality. What more do you want to call a spade a spade?
huh
No no, this is tantamount to violently storming the capital to delay the certification of the election.
huh
I can’t believe people thought that was actually “violently storming” the capitol
It was a protest. Methinks you’ve never seen an actual violent crowd
Lol fuck off troll.
That wasn’t violence. Why they did it and the Trump thing is stupid but an actually violent attack would have been actually successful at purging the congressional ranks.
And fuck off, .world mods, me saying what I wish had happened isn’t a call for violence
Ah yes, I remember when they peacefully bludgeoned that police officer.
Sorry, my bad. Shouldn’t have given you the benefit of the doubt in assuming that you were a troll and not just braindead.
I mean, they only tried to help him wake-up because he was sleeping on the job. So it’s just good samaritans helping a poor soul.
He’s a cop. He has no right to live
So edgy and cool.
So as long as an attack isn’t successful, it isn’t violent? Then the attempted assassination of Trump also wasn’t violent. Just a peaceful protest.
Violence would be the Oklahoma City bombing. That actually accomplished something and was great. We need much more of that.
Jan 6th couldn’t be successful because there wasn’t actual violence. The fact nobody was killed, not even the cops, shows it was all bullshit (except for that stupid girl who was killed for lack of shooting back)
It’s the same disconnect from reality as the guy who shot at Trump thinking an AR was an “high powered rifle for killing” like it’s always portrayed when it’s totally wrong and appropriate for that shot. He was a moron and if he’d actually studied at all Trump would be dead. We can only hope the next attempt is successful. There’s still time for Biden too.
violence is when guns and bombs and death
Smooooooothbraaaaaiiiiin
I can’t believe people thought that was actually “violently storming” the capitol
It was a protest. Methinks you’ve never seen an actual violent crowd
There’s a video here of some of the peaceful protesting:
And that’s not violence. That’s less trouble than a soccer fans
Yeah, I guess Michael Fanone, the officer who got brain damage, burns, a heart attack and PTSD, after being beaten and given electric shocks by the crowd, was just failing to perceive the peacefulness of the situation.
This isn’t going “full MAGA”. This isn’t even going half MAGA. Shit, this isn’t even going a little MAGA. He’s very clearly saying he approves of the pick.
Mentioning that Democrats are trash on dealing with corporations is just fine. Good, even.
Lying through your god damn teeth that Republicans are going to do anything other than lie to gain more leverage for their jihad to fuck over their fellow man is delusional at best.
I dunno what’s worse. Lying about Republicans being “for the little guy”, or actually believing it. Both point to significant logic, reasoning, and judgmental flaws in Proton’s leadership.
I’ve been calling America a corporate dictatorship for well over a decade, so Yen/Proton realizing the Dem’s are captured is welcomed, but the belief that R’s are better in 2025 is completely insane.
I’ve got 18 months left on my current plan, so that’ll give me time to see how deep this clusterfuck goes and transition away if need be.
I’ve been calling America a corporate dictatorship for well over a decade,
Have you heard of inverted totalitarianism?
Thank you for being one of the saner takes in this thread.
Call out the bad and insane parts of Andy Yen’s comment. Also call out the good. Don’t fall for the same trap that Yen himself got caught in by painting the entire thing as “full MAGA”. The characterization from this post’s title feels similar to me as Yen himself saying “all Democrats bad and care only for the big guy”.
Oh Andy, the Republicans won’t think of you as “one of the good ones” and protect you from their white America policies.
Here’s what he said in Reddit
Source: https://snoo.habedieeh.re/r/ProtonMail/comments/1i1zjgn/comment/m7ahrlm/
Andy here, since it’s my original post that’s being reposted here, let me comment further.
My post is talking about Gail Slater, who is by all measures, actually a good pick, with a solid track record of being on the right side of the antitrust issue. Yes, she happens to be nominated by Trump, but her record speaks for itself.
This is not going to be a popular opinion, but on the specific issue of antitrust, Democrats fell short. In 2022, we campaigned extensively in the US for anti-trust legislation. Two bills were ready, with bipartisan support. Chuck Schumer (who coincidently has two daughters working as big tech lobbyists) refused to bring the bills for a vote. In the aftermath of this failure, great people like former Democratic rep David Cicilline left congress, leaving few strong voices for antitrust left in the Democratic party. In the meantime, at a 2024 event covering antitrust remedies, out of all the invited senators, just a single one showed up - JD Vance.
By working on the front lines of many policy issues, we have seen the shift between Dems and Republicans over the past decade first hand. And that’s a missed opportunity for Dems, because by and large, support for cracking down on corporate monopolies is popular on both sides of the political spectrum. Unfortunately, corporate capture of Dems is real and in the end money won. It is hard to see how this changes, and Republicans are likely to lead the antitrust charge in the coming years.
From that perspective, and going back to my original post, Gail is a great pick. One should not equate our support of Gail for Proton not being neutral anymore. We continue to call out bad behavior from both sides, whether it’s Dems or Republicans, on our core issues. Just a few weeks ago, we were called out for being in bed with Soros because we gave money to too many “liberal” organizations: https://proton.me/blog/2024-lifetime-fundraiser-results No, the Proton Foundation isn’t the new Soros either (even if we may coincidentally fund some of the same things sometimes). We simply stick with our strongly held core believes, and leave politics out of it, because the issues we care about, should be apolitical.
UPDATE: I posted another comment further below in response to a user, but I’ll reproduce it here for completeness:
I don’t really want to wade further into what is obviously a very polarizing political topic, but since you are asking for some thoughts, I can share.
We have been fighting big corporate interests since the very beginning. People have short memories, so few remember that in 2019 and 2020, we were working with congressional Democrats on this issue. We’re even cited a dozen times in the report, which by the way, was partially authored by Lina Khan, who at that time worked with Ciciline. This is the report here: https://proton.me/blog/congress-antitrust-report
The American Innovation and Choice Online Act (AICOA) was also mentioned. Guess what, we supported that too: https://proton.me/blog/congress-stand-up-to-big-tech More than with blog posts, I personally was on Capitol Hill trying to convince senators who were on the fence, on both the Democratic and Republican side. The votes where there, but in 2022, Democrats controlled the Senate, and ultimately Sen. Schumer decided what gets to be voted on, and as we know, AICOA was not advanced.
Epic vs Apple was also mentioned. Well, we supported that one too. In fact, we were one of the founding companies of the Coalition for App Fairness, along with, yes, Epic: https://proton.me/blog/coalition-for-app-fairness
The point I am trying to make is, in the past 10 years, our position on corporate monopolies has not moved. But US politics has shifted, and the parties themselves have moved. We’re huge supporters of Lina Khan and her work. But you know who else agrees with Lina Khan on Big Tech? Actually, JD Vance, as he’s publicly stated: https://fortune.com/2024/08/11/jd-vance-5000-child-tax-credit-support-ftc-lina-khan-tech-regulation/ Can you imagine the Republican Vice Presidents of the past taking this position?
It is not a bad thing that Republicans have moved so far on this issue, and are now in a position to go even further than Democrats have managed in the past four years. It’s a good thing, and something that should be welcomed irrespective of your political leanings. Ultimately, we will judge actions, but for now, I am supportive of Gail Slater, just as I was supportive of Lina Khan. And honestly, it should not matter that one is a Republican, and the other is a Democrat.
Interesting perspective. With this context this makes sense. Thanks for posting
Later there was an official statement posted stating the previous post made with the Proton account wasn’t an official post. https://www.reddit.com/r/ProtonMail/comments/1i2nz9v/on_politics_and_proton_a_message_from_andy/
What a shit show. Sack the guy.
Thanks for compilation, hopefully next administration can at least do what your post suggests.
Hopefully the next administration can post the contents of reddit on Lemmy so VPN users can read it?
Lol what?
I understood your post, but maybe put Andy’s comment in a Quote indentation.
Are multilinear comments possible? Or so I have to type like 200 > chars
Are you on mobile? On desktop, you just highlight the text and it the " icon.
I’m on mobile
God help you.
add a “>” to the beginning of every paragraph, and the empty lines between them, and it will render as a big blockquote:
> paragraph one > > paragraph twoparagraph one
paragraph two
Yk what else you could imagine?
What?
i think they’re telling you to go fuck yourself? unsure but that seems to be it
I can deal with Andy Yen being a dumbass in his own time, but the official Proton reddit account doubling down on this shit is over the line for me.
I literally just renewed for 2 years a couple days ago. I will be looking for alternatives and hopefully I can get a partial refund or something.
Was about to pay for proton. Not now
I’m glad I never did. I looked into proton a few months back and was highly suspicious of their non-profit status. I could never put my finger on why but felt off.
Glad I never fully committed to it.
Non-profit is a tax status not a business plan.
There’s Mullvad.
Unfortunately I made the mistake of really digging myself into the Proton ecosystem.
My current plan is:
VPN -> Mullvad
Mail -> Tuta
Pass -> Bitwarden (not sure if I want to host yet)
Drive -> Nextcloud (Self-Hosted)
Calendar -> Nextcloud (Self-Hosted)
Standard Notes -> Memos (Self-Hosted) (already done)
Simple Login -> no fucking clue, I am dreading migrating these.
I was JUST about to take that plunge myself.
I just migrated all of my aliases to addy.io, but I was also fortunate in that all of my aliases were based on a domain that I own. It was a simple as exporting the alias list to a CSV, formatting it a little for addy.io, then importing it!
If all of your aliases are based off of simple login domains, then that’s gonna be a lot harder. You’ll have to change your email on all of your. If that’s the case, in the future, I would definitely recommend getting a second domain for generating these aliases so that migrating is the problem in the future!
As for addy.io, I honestly love the service. The Lite plan is plenty for my needs and only costs $12 a year. That and Bitwarden are a steal imo.
I was also fortunate in that all of my aliases were based on a domain that I own.
I’m in the same boat luckily, so maybe this won’t be as bad as I’m expecting. I’ll take a look at Addy.io as well, thanks for the recommendation!
Great guide! I believe Tuta has the simple login functions.
Is there a reason you’re not planning on migrating both mail and calendar to Tuta?
Mostly because if I’m going to go through the trouble of maintaining a Nextcloud instance, I might as well use its calendar to maintain more control of my data. If Nextcloud gives me trouble down the line (as it tends to do in my experience) then I’ll give Tuta’s calendar a try.
I’m optimistic for Nextcloud though, the latest AIO docker versions seem solid.
I have a Nextcloud Instance that’s been pretty solid for me for a couple years, but I don’t use their all-in-one image so I can’t comment on that. I do use Radicale instead of Nextcloud’s calendar/contacts though and I removed basically all of the Nextcloud apps except the file sharing. Idk why. I just don’t like when everything is in one thing lol
Do you happen to know any alternatives for their email? Some security guy on YouTube was talking about how their email aliasing is better because if you lose a single email/password combo, you’re not subject to any other breaches.
I mean I already use a password manager since I adopted KeePass like 15 years ago and use Bitwarden now, but I still like that concept.
Posteo or tuta or fastmail.
Depends on if anyone you message uses proton. If they do, you can always get their pgp key and save it to thunderbird. If nobody you know uses proton, there is no benefit to their service over the above.
https://cyberinsider.com/email/alternatives-to-gmail/ “10 Best Alternatives to Gmail in 2025 (Private & Secure)”
The list is useful because there is comparison information to help you to decide. Proton Mail is on the list, which means some of the comparisons are relative to Proton Mail.
This is one of the reasons I will never fork over so much cash for a yearly subscription to anything. I pay monthly on everything I subscribe to, because you never know when that service decides, “Yeah. Fuck it. Let’s go downhill, full sprint!”
Wait, so his solution to abuse in big tech is…hiring someone who formerly worked in big tech…? Okay…
So is this an intentional or unintentional get off of proton message? Maybe it’s a subtle "we are compromised but warrant Canaries don’t work message? Lol…
Wait I’m confused why this is him going full MAGA?
I legitimately don’t want the Republicans in charge of anything unless they drastically change their policies, but this actually seems like a pretty decent pick considering the absolute trash that trump has nominated so far?
If she is actually trying to break up these companies that’s generally good right? We’ve been wanting to break monopolies for a while.
If Republicans go so far right that they swing back around to the left I’d be fine with that lol
I’m not voting because of the letter next to their name, I’m voting because of policies. If someone wants to provide universal health care, protect the environment, break up monopolies, stop price gouging, stop hating gay and trans people for no reason, etc. I will vote for them. And yes I understand that the republican party as it is is the least likely group of people to ever do that. But the democrats didn’t do it either they just pay it lip service when they want votes.
Vote for actual policies you want, not because someone pretends they’re a D or an R.
If Republicans go so far right that they swing back around to the left I’d be fine with that lol
Hitler’s regime launching the first anti-smoking propaganda campaign in history doesn’t mean they were going “so far right that they swing back around to the left.”
Please stop this liberal “horseshoe” bullshit.
Mate there was a pretty big if
Im under no illusions that they will actually go left whatsoever
Not full maga, but not good trend. Its a rather unforced error.
You need to read Andy’s replies after people questioned him on that initial post. I linked to an archived thread in my OP, or you can check the Proton Mail subreddit.
I read his replies; what about them are “full MAGA”?
I’m assuming you’re arguing in bad faith, or you missed his uniformly glowing praise of Republicans and how they defend “the little guy” as opposed to the corrupt dems.
This is the comment which you linked to, copied and pasted:
Here is our official response, also available on the Mastodon post in the screenshot: Corporate capture of Dems is real. In 2022, we campaigned extensively in the US for anti-trust legislation. Two bills were ready, with bipartisan support. Chuck Schumer (who coincidently has two daughters working as big tech lobbyists) refused to bring the bills for a vote. At a 2024 event covering antitrust remedies, out of all the invited senators, just a single one showed up - JD Vance. By working on the front lines of many policy issues, we have seen the shift between Dems and Republicans over the past decade first hand. Dems had a choice between the progressive wing (Bernie Sanders, etc), versus corporate Dems, but in the end money won and constituents lost. Until corporate Dems are thrown out, the reality is that Republicans remain more likely to tackle Big Tech abuses.
This doesn’t seem like a glowing commendation to me. It seems he said exactly what he thinks happened, and that only one person showed up. He even brings up the fact that Dems could choose the progressive wing with Bernie, but that they chose to follow the money. That’s not false either.
I really don’t get how this is full MAGA, unless you’re stating that anything that praises the Republicans is full MAGA.
unless you’re stating that anything that praises the Republicans is full MAGA
If you’ll read the thread, this is not the first time he has praised Trump.
Just so everyone is clear, this is what you’re framing as “praise”:
It is not Trump’s fault
It is tempting to blame all this on Trump, but that is taking the easy way out. All Trump does is put a new face on the existing privacy problem, so now it concerns a segment of the population that previously didn’t care as much. Proton Mail users have always come from both the left and right side of the political spectrum. Today, we are seeing an influx of liberal users, but Proton Mail has also long been popular with the political right, who were truly worried about big government spying, and the Obama administration having access to their communications. Now the tables have turned.
The same terror the political right has experienced is now being felt in liberal bubbles such as Silicon Valley for the first time. The left is correct to be terrified of a Trump-led NSA snooping on their communications, especially since Silicon Valley giants like Google and Facebook can be forced to spy on users on behalf of Trump’s NSA. However, this precedent was not set by Trump – he hasn’t even taken office yet. The first major incident of a US tech giant being complicit in US government spying actually took place in 2015 under the Obama administration(new window).
Why did you leave out the part about democrats being corrupt and republicans being champions of the little guy?
Where’s the quote, Cygnus? Or can we just assume you were lying?
I already posted several examples in this thread which you keep conspicuously ignoring, but here’s another for you as I permanently exit this conversation. https://x.com/andyyen/status/1812442643726537182?mx=2
We’re still waiting on this quote, btw
how much you paying to deliver this quote?
So you are being absurdly hyperbolic. Gotcha.
If Republicans go so far right that they swing back around to the left I’d be fine with that lol
That’s not a thing.
Everybody is freaking out at the proton guy because he doesn’t think zuckerberg, musk and bezos are big tech
You can’t apply logic to a situation and expect lemmings to understand.
And that’s that… I was building up momentum at home to just move to proton mail. Now? Now I got no choice but to figure out another way to self host my own email somehow. That’s an f-ing PITA.
Cancelled my yearly subscription. Mozilla, for all its faults, is at least doing things for a better and more open internet that provides a semblance of privacy. Most importantly they are smart enough to not bootlick in public.
Gonna migrate my passwords to Mozilla pass manager and move my vpn to something like Mozilla vpn or mullvad or something.
Just canceled my subscription and let them know in the comments it was because of this.
It’s a shame. As soon as my current VPN ran out, I was going to give them some money. I guess he should have kept his MAGA thoughts to himself.
Same, especially because I can’t get on Pornhub without one anymore!
Definitely no conflict of interest from this chode.
I did the same. Also mailed them asking to cancel my account and refunding me the remaing balance.
Same
CEOs having a “who can suck off Trump best” contest?
Gonna need to expand this
You are missing class analysis. Fascism is good for business and wealth accumulation.
This is how it’s feeling like, last few weeks. I’ll somehow need to justify keeping my proton plan
Yeah I’m in the same boat, I mostly use the VPN I wonder what security it actualy gives now.
It never gave you any, that claim that every VPN provider makes about security and privacy is mostly false. It saves you from like two types of attacks that are so specific I can almost guarantee you you never encountered them in the wild. They also make it 10% harder for your local provider to keep tabs on you at the expense of introducing another very specific ledger of everything you do, that belongs to a trump loving company apparently, and unlike your ISP they are legallly allowed to do whatever they want with it.
It’s not what VPN is for.Mine do protect me very well for what I’m using it for. They have to break Swiss law to not to.
What do you mean?
You said VPNs are not useful, right? Or so I understood it. It’s just so that my VPN is definitely useful for me in a couple of usecases.
No, that’s not what I said, I said that commercial companies make a lot of misleading claims about their products and about what naked VPN does.
And I’m curious about your application and how does it provide security to you
